8/30/2006


"A man's country is not a certain area of land, of mountains, rivers, and woods, but it is a principle; and patriotism is loyalty to that principle."

George William Curtis
Author, Editor, Orator, Reformer

16 comments:

Cato said...

I really don't get that picture. I don't think democracy (rule of the majority) and freedom go hand in hand to begin with, but I also don't think freedom nor democracy condemned Christ. The picture jsut doesn't seem to make sense at all. Perhaps you can put forth a few words of your 1,000 to explain.

1,000 Words said...

CATO:
You may need to think about this for a bit. This might not dovetail into the clearly defined, black and white, ideological drop slots.

You think about the connotations of this post and comeback with what you think is going on with this combination of words and pictures. I will follow with my intentions for doing this post.

AndyRand said...

One K words,
I was going to explain it to CATO but I'm with you now. He should think it over. I can't believe you don't get it CATO? I guess that just demonstrates the vastness of the divide between our modes of thought.

Wow.

1,000 Words said...

Cato:

There's a picture and some key words: "principle" and "patriotism."

The principle deals with the Middle East. It's a concept joined by religious beliefs, as opposed to countries with the specific boundaries. The "patriotism" refers to the blind adherence to those religious beliefs. We see the Bush centurion -- an invader -- handing the crucified person -- Is it Christ? Is it society? -- the hammer that will set him free. Of course, the hammer is democracy, as defined by the invader.

Of Christ, using the dilemma of the Christ analogy, as an individual human, Christ would have no doubt wanted to take the hammer, free himself and live to see another day. However, as the son of God, he is nailed to the cross by the group think of patriotism.

It's all about the individual desires of democracy and it's implied freedoms v. patriotism and it's mob rule mentality.

Cato said...

That's the most asinine thing I've heard all day.


Did you read your own quote? Are we speaking the same language?

"A man's country is not a certain area of land, of mountains, rivers, and woods, but it is a principle; and patriotism is loyalty to that principle."

The quote speaks of how to be a patriot one must fight for (be loyal to) your ideals, not mere physical boundries. The only relation to Bush is his Wilsonian "make the world safe for democracy" attitude that recognizes no boundries.

We have here a picture of Bush dressed as a Roman. You start speaking of democracy and freedom -- two things not associated with Christ or Rome -- and equate them to things in this picture. The hammer being a tool to set people free? I cannot fathom how you get these things.

1,000 Words said...

Cato:

I'm not surprised at your inability to think creatively. Likewise, I find your attacks on my observation quite rude for someone who prides himself on his ability to intellectualize in complete sentences -- even though you your opinions goose-step squarely along the chorus line of cut-n-paste political indoctrination. Because you interpret the ink blotter differently than me, you take the personal attack and put-down route...maybe someone else posted that comment under Cato's name?

It's interesting that don't see the hammer would remove the nails in Christ's hands and free up his individuality.

"Patriotism" is all about words. Bush uses the words of that connote patriotism while his actions speak differently.

Cato said...

Since "creativity" means words can be whatever it is you want them to be and warp any quote into meaning anything you want, words have lost all meaning.

666 said...

Yo Cato:

I think he put that cartoon with the quote because the blood puddle matches the red font color used for the quote.

In the context of politics and cultural manipulation, words haven't lost all meaning. Rather, they have gained additional meaning. It's more like words have been have some many meaning that it's meaningless to find out what the meaning is. Maybe that's why God made beer?

Cato said...

God did not make beer.

If words have the supposed non-meaning as you suggest than then no amount of patriotism towards the principle of your country would ever be worth a damn. And so now we live in a upside-down world where democracy is good, socialists are liberals, and war is peace. The use of "creativity" in language is what is the cause of this.

I like to think I can stem the tide. That quote clearly says that devotion to the principles that guide your country is what patriotism is. Postmodernist jibberish ought end.

666 said...

Cato:

As you try to stem the tide, do you ever get the feeling that the only thing left of the dike is you finger?

If God didn't invent beer, surely he must have created swear words!

Paging Casper Wienberger said...

In regards to cato's quote:

"The only relation to Bush is his Wilsonian "make the world safe for democracy" attitude that recognizes no boundries.

You must be joking!
Bush has proven that he "recognizes no boundries" in his handling of many parts of the current war, except the most important part - which would be giving our troops equipment needed to win and controlling the borders and actually making it possible to make IRAQ safe for democracy.
Cato, do you blindly support the party line enough to believe that the civil war in Iraq is all part of the plan for democracy and it is working? And please don't insult our intelligence with claims that our brave soldiers are feeling that they have no support due to Kerry, Murtha and other Americans who actually got their hands dirty in a war, but see faults with this one (politics aside.)
Don't get me wrong cato, I am no peacenick. I was for removing Sadam, but I am ashamed of the way this war has been run. You won't admit it but I bet you are ashamed too. The world is looking at a weakened America but what the hell, right cato, just blame it on Clinton.
You go on talking in circles
Ronald Reagan never looked so good.

AndyRand said...

CATO:
You Said:
"Since "creativity" means words can be whatever it is you want them to be and warp any quote into meaning anything you want, words have lost all meaning."

This is the stupidest absolutist gibberish I'VE ever heard. I know of nobody who would accept the definition of "creativity you've proposed above.
Words for the most part have an agreed upon meaning to a general population that speaks a common language. They also have connotations that that arise from the combination of the agreed meaning and the interpreters personal experience and point of reference.
If words had but one absolute meaning there would be long unemployment lines for Book reveiwers and Biblical scholars to name but 2 professions. In reading your comments here it is apparent that to you there can only be one meaning to a word and that meaning is literal and in agreement with your opinions.
This demonstrates to me that you indeed do not understand what creativity is and are incapable of comprehending it.
I find this to be a very ridgid and limiting perspective. Frankly, I'm surprised to learn that there are people like yourself that hold these views. I can accept that you see things this way and are entitled to do so, but don't expect the rest of the world to follow along.

AndyRand said...

To Paging Casper Wienberger:

I believe that CATO has said in other posts here that he does not support the war.(correct me if I'm wrong).
Pehaps for a totally different set of reasons though.
I think you and myself are guilty of making assumptions about CATO's opinions because we tend to paint him as "right wing" and "conservative" and
project upon him beliefs that we assume he holds.
I'll let him speak for himself, but I'm sure he stated his opposition to the war and you are arguing with him as if he were a supporter of it.

Cato said...

Andy, thank you for all your praise. "I find this to be a very ridgid and limiting perspective." Ahh yes, I too find it very insightful, not to brag or anything. "This is the stupidest absolutist gibberish I'VE ever heard." Oh really? You're too kind. I sometimes think I'm that good of a wordsmith but this whole thing wasn't as awesome as you describe.


Andy, I know meanings of words change. But meanings of what people said do not. The quote still means that people hold true to their ideals of their country regardles sof boundries. And it is Wilsonian (Bush is his intellectual heir, interestingly enough, ha!)

And yes, I did not support the war and still do not. A just American government would not waste American blood and treasure on the welfare of Iraqis.

AndyRand said...

CATO:
I was going to put a qualifier in my earlier comment in regard to your rigid perspective ( as seen from my point of view). I'm sure you've taken this as a personal attack, and I probably didn't word it in the best way possible, I didn't mean it as such.
What I find difficult to understand is your mindset, as I'm sure you find mine the same. That's what I was being critcal of.

You said:
"Since "creativity" means words can be whatever it is you want them to be and warp any quote into meaning anything you want, words have lost all meaning."

You've exaggerated what "creativity" is in regard to language is. That's what I'm being critical of. I was not referring to Bush and Wilson at all though they were mentioned earlier.
It's difficult to express my opinion
of your thought modality seperate from your identity as CATO.
I'm not particularly fond of the mindset you express here. That does not necessarily mean I'm not fond of you. I don't know you. Maybe your a great fun loving guy. I just don't know. I didn't mean to offend.

Cato said...

I was not offended I was being sarcastic in trying to explain why words have specific meanings when they were said. If they don't then we are speaking two different languages.